Dealing With The Grief Around Us

Why does everything feel so heavy right now?

In this episode of Speaking of Faith, Bishop DeDe and Adam name what many of us are carrying: grief. We've talked about the grief of personal loss, but this episode, we dive into grief over a world that feels unstable—seeminglt rife with division, conflict, strained relationships, and the constant churn of social media.

Bishop DeDe reminds us that much of our anger and anxiety is rooted in sorrow. When we don’t acknowledge that grief, it can harden into blame or dehumanization. The invitation instead is to slow down and return to the foundations of our faith: scripture, prayer, humility. We are not God, and we are not responsible for fixing everything.

One surprising theme in this conversation is whimsy. In overwhelming times, small acts of joy—learning something new, creating, laughing, stepping away from the noise—aren’t distractions. They’re stabilizers. They help keep our hearts soft.

The episode also offers practical wisdom for navigating conflict, especially online. Social media rarely changes hearts. Relationships are built through patience, mercy, and restraint. Sometimes faithfulness looks like choosing not to engage.

At its core, this conversation is about tending your soul so that what flows from you is compassion rather than fear. You are not called to save the world. You are called to love within it.

Even now, you are loved, you are blessed—and you can be a blessing.

AI Disclosure: To support our staff in their limited time, many of our episode summaries are first generated by AI and then edited by the Communications Director to accurately reflect and preview our podcast episodes.

Transcript

Bishop DeDe (00:01.934)
Hey friends, welcome to the podcast, Speaking of Faith. My name is DeDe Duncan-Probe. I am the Episcopal Bishop of Central New York. I'm joined by Adam Eichelberger, who is our Director of Communications. And we're here to speak about faith, which in this time, I don't know about you, but it seems almost impossible to do because it's so emotionally charged and so ramped up and we're in a war situation.

where religion is being thrown around willy-nilly and people who mean, who have good intentions, I think are not aware of how they're contributing to a time in which our faith is really driving us apart and is leading us in ways that are not what our faith would intend. The emotionality of this moment, the feelings, the fear, and after a pandemic, is,

recorded, we've talked about it on this podcast, there are recognizable responses in humans to pandemic and times of suffering, and that follows a certain path. We're in the midst of a pattern that is long recognizable in history, you know, where you can see the the rise of fear, the desire, the rise of emotionality, and the inability to talk about what actually brings us together. And

A word that I'd say a lot, but I think can't be said really too much is dehumanization. In this time, people are dehumanizing one another. Those people, they should just be wiped off the face of the earth. These talking points where how we speak drives us not toward God, but actually away from God and not toward health, but away from our own souls. And so in the midst of this time, and we've talked about a number of these things on the podcast,

But I want to zero in on something that might not at first come to mind for us, which is grief. It can seem like, but we were talking about fear and emotionality and all of, and those things are all true. But the grief we may feel is that life isn't how we thought it was, or our faith, we want it to be a certain way and we're finding it confusing. Why is God allowing X to happen? Or.

Bishop DeDe (02:28.448)
Well, shouldn't we be affirming this because of what the Bible says? And so all of these confusing narratives, the losses of relationships in our lives, the divisions among people, the inability to talk about what's important to us, the way in which we may start to say something that we really feel and someone jumps in with some rhetoric or we're like, no, that's not what I meant. And I wasn't trying to say that. And suddenly it becomes so supercharged.

that we're just kind of bound by it all and silenced by it all. And there's a lot of grief in this moment. We, a lot of us know people who have died, people who we love but see no longer. The memories of a simpler time can bring up memories of people we have loved, but who may have been gone for a long time from this earthly plane, but yet in the midst of all of this, we can't help being drawn back to.

gosh, if they were here now, what they would think or gosh, I wish they were here now because I would feel better or I need help in this time. that another word disenfranchisement where we're kind of cut off from those things that have brought us a sense of stability, those things that have helped us in these times. And so we are all of us dealing with this grief, this loss of the whatever may be present for you, how it may be

Feel how it may feel for you and so when we speak about our faith It can seem like the last thing we really want to do because it just makes it harder And so for all of us, what do we do about that? What do we do about a gospel that calls us to proclaim Jesus? What do we do about a faith that calls us to be active in the way we live and so Listener you may have things that you're doing that are bringing you joy

one thing that I really highly recommend to you, which will sound like I'm just avoiding something, but it's whimsy. When's the last time you just did something whimsical, something that was life-giving to you, but not necessarily doesn't harm anyone. Doesn't harm yourself. Isn't just allows you to be lighthearted, laughing with a friend, listening to music, you know, going for a walk in the woods, even though it's really been very cold here.

Bishop DeDe (04:53.614)
coloring, weaving, picking up a fabric craft, or just simply sitting in silence and letting your soul relax. Those are all wonderfully sacred practices. But whimsy is that a little bit even more intentionally. It's where there's something where we're like, well, I haven't done that since I was a little child. Well, maybe skipping is a good thing to bring back if you can do it safely. You know, maybe.

something that used to bring you joy that you haven't done in a while. What's something that when you were young, you just loved and it filled you with a sense of life. That whimsical nature and to allow ourselves space for something that isn't always so serious can really help us and really be an outlet for these things. And anyone who has suffered the loss of a person knows that sometimes we need new habits to take up painting or take up.

clay work or to do something where we're taking those feelings and putting them into something and getting them kind of out of our mind and heart but into an expression. All of us need these places with grief to offer that healing expression and to allow ourselves to feel what we're really feeling. So much of the emotionality I think of this time.

is what humans naturally do when they're trying to avoid feeling how scary it is, trying to avoid feeling how sad we are, trying to avoid feeling how confused we are. It's a confusing time. Who do we listen to? Who do we believe? How do we even know what's going on in a way? It feels so destabilizing. And so that word destabilizing can help us.

Because right on the heels of it often we start dehumanizing. When we feel off kilter, it must be someone's fault. Those people, if they were just different, I wouldn't feel so bad. And so when we're speaking of our faith, to really pay attention to the fact that we can't speak out of nothingness because that's not how we are. We speak out of something, whether it's out of our fear, out of our grief, out of our longing.

Bishop DeDe (07:12.458)
out of sometimes we speak thinking we're right about everything. And anytime we feel like we're right about everything, that should be like a red flag, know, warning, warning, Will Robinson. If you think you're right about everything, you know, you've crossed the threshold, man, or woman. God is God and we're not God and we're not perfect. And so humility, curiosity do need to make a comeback for the health of our own souls to realize that we

may be feeling fear and there may be real reasons for that. It may be a time where we really are feeling threatened and yet we can find places of safety where we can be with other people and build up those places of safety. With the clergy retreat this last week, we gathered for a clergy gathering and we were talking about the grief that's in our parishes, the confusion that people are feeling.

and the desire for something that's bigger and clarifying in this moment. So I encourage all of us when we're speaking about our faith, and especially when we're recognizing the grief and the confusion, the destabilization, the temptation to dehumanize, that we begin with the bedrock of our faith, to open the Bible, read a passage of scripture, let it wash over our souls. Lectio Divina is a wonderful practice.

to read scripture and read it as a prayer. What is God saying here? How does this apply to what's happening right now? And how might I apply the scripture in the living of my life? And then I've said it before on here and on live, but to practice meditation through breathing, to breathe in and have a verse or a phrase that we think, to breathe out slowly and allow ourselves to be present to the space where we are.

to not let ourselves get carried away or destabilized, but to rather center on what we believe to be true. And then when we speak about our faith, when we have centered and we have something we want to say, to speak with kindness and generosity, to offer forgiveness and support. And we can say to someone, you know, I hear you saying that, but it really, I'm uncomfortable talking that way about the situation because I'm aware that people are suffering.

Bishop DeDe (09:40.298)
And I want to be prayerful about that. I recognize the world is hurting and I recognize that I'm hurting. And so I want to offer that to God and not more hatred. I want to speak words of forgiveness and love and the fruits of the spirit to reconnect with what I believe most to be true. And that reframing stabilizes us, that reframing gives us a basis. Then when we speak, we kind of know which end is up.

that God loves us, that God is with us. So I've said a lot of things about grief and destabilization, how it leads to that temptation to dehumanize, and how we can begin to speak of our faith in a way that restabilizes us, that re-centers us in God's forgiveness. So Adam, I'm going to welcome you to the conversation. When we talk about this, how does that sit in your life?

Adam Eichelberger (10:36.079)
I'd like that you brought up this idea of whimsy. and I know that it, I'm going to say from the rip, it's gotta be difficult for so many people to try and hold space for something like whimsy when there's so much that's going on around us, regardless of how you feel. It is overwhelming right now, the amount of information that is coming at us. And I think for me, I have struggled mightily with this right now.

Bishop DeDe (10:40.142)
Mm-hmm.

Bishop DeDe (10:44.056)
Ha ha ha.

Bishop DeDe (10:55.15)
Mm-hmm.

It is.

Adam Eichelberger (11:06.039)
simply because it's like, do I continue living my daily life and try and make room for this stuff while I see so much going on around me? And I start feeling this sense of guilt about, the reason, the reason that struck me so hard is I have a friend who is, who's got a really hard cancer diagnosis and he's going through that with his family. He lives across the country and out of nowhere, not to,

Bishop DeDe (11:12.536)
Yeah.

Bishop DeDe (11:21.646)
Mm-hmm.

Adam Eichelberger (11:35.804)
Get too into this guys, but stay with me. At my age discovered a love of collecting Pokemon cards with my kids. And that seems really silly because no, well, it was a thing that when this came about in the nineties, I was too old for, and I got made, people would get made fun of for it. But now I have this thing and now my kids do it and we do it with them on FaceTime and all this stuff. And the other day I literally had this thought.

Bishop DeDe (11:46.124)
We won't judge you, we won't judge you. Go ahead.

Bishop DeDe (11:55.405)
Right.

Adam Eichelberger (12:05.809)
that lines up a lot with this, which is like, how do I continue doing this silly little hobby for the shiny cardboard when everything seems on fire? And the reason I bring this up is I think this is really relatable for us, for those of us who listen or watch who are Christians, because I think it's fair to say Jesus had to walk in this tension of living a human life and finding joy and living.

with joy, and I would say that Jesus probably found whimsy in things, but also the anxiety of things being really difficult all around us. So I guess my question for us, as we are speaking of our faith, is like, how do we navigate that tension between finding those things to renew our peace, like whimsy, while we see that things are so hard all around us? And how do we bring our faith into that?

Bishop DeDe (12:52.792)
Mm-hmm.

Adam Eichelberger (12:58.799)
discussion that we have with people because I don't know about any of you listeners or viewers the idea of like talking about these I'm using our quotes for the audio listeners these silly little things seems Bad like I feel bad about it. So how do we how do we walk in that tension? Bring our faith or our hopes or our beliefs into that space because the tension is palpable

Bishop DeDe (13:24.632)
and I'm so glad you brought that up because I do think we struggle with that. think we need to be serious because these are serious things. And we do when we're talking, there are times to be serious that, know, Ecclesiastes or Ecclesiastes, you know, we can look at the Proverbs, we can look at Isaiah, we can look at places where, you know, there's a season and there's these times.

One, we cannot solve what's wrong in the whole world. And you, I mean, I want to affirm your Pokemon things. I saw the other day that in Japan, they have a whole subway train that they made in a design for Pokemon. But I don't know if that was the bottom. Did they really do that? so you're right on the cutting edge there socially. But you know, we're not God.

Adam Eichelberger (14:03.238)
They did. Yeah.

Bishop DeDe (14:14.152)
And whether or not you play Pokemon, it is not going to solve the world's ills. But you know what might solve is it will lift your heart. You'll re-center with yourself and with your kids. You'll have a bit of joy and you'll take that joy into the world. And we get too serious minded. And we also kind of think that we're kind of God-like in a way where if we just focused, we get it right enough and all this would stop or change or be better.

And so with relationships, especially we do this, I think a lot with our relationships, we have a falling out with somebody. So we go and we talk to them seriously and it doesn't work. And we go talk to them seriously and it doesn't work. They come talk to us seriously and it doesn't work. But we never think of saying, you know what, why don't we go fishing? Or especially summer year, it's ice fishing. I just want to make note of that. Or why don't we go for a walk and not talk and just pray?

Adam Eichelberger (15:04.667)
You

Bishop DeDe (15:09.386)
Instead of coming at something straight up the mountain, what if we took a winding road around through the valley? Jesus throughout scripture, I think Dr. Ian Markham at VTS, a little shout out for Dr. Markham is he speaks a lot about the humor in scripture and the humor with Jesus. There are moments when Jesus is asleep in the boat and they're in the storm. And he's like, what, what, why did you wake me up? Where recognizing that

One of the things we can bring to the world that is a true just gift is that in the midst of sorrow, there's joy in the midst of challenge. There's hope. And so it isn't going to help the world for us to be less hopeful, less joyful. It actually might transform our own little corner of the world. If we started recognizing with humility, that's, think when I talk about humility, when you said that, I thought, you know, I talk about humility. I think I don't define what I mean by it.

which is the letting go of being responsible for everything. That trap, that sin of thinking that we're responsible for everything. That sin of thinking that we need to be right all the time so that it can be right. To be humble and recognize we're sinners saved by grace. And maybe the best thing we could do to get today together is to laugh or do something like Pokemon or do something like, you know, listen to a...

something that brings us joy and gives us a lightness of heart. Because then we'll take that into the world. I think it's essential and I think it's perfect illustration.

Adam Eichelberger (16:46.054)
Yeah. And it's interesting you brought that up about the our compunction or our desire to be right. I think that a lot of times when we look at things like the 10 commandments, everybody, regardless of your faith, kind of knows the 10 commandments that first commandment, in my opinion, is less about I'm going to erect an idol. It's more it's more so it's even less about there is this figure that I'm holding up.

Bishop DeDe (16:58.357)
Yeah.

Bishop DeDe (17:07.021)
Yep.

Adam Eichelberger (17:13.962)
as somebody I worship or want to emulate, it's really more about, I making an idol out of myself? Am I owning or trying to take on the role of God in not just my life, but in other people's lives? I've talked, I've talked a lot several times on this show about, I participate in a program called Al-Anon, which is for the loved ones of people who are struggling with substance use disorders and

Bishop DeDe (17:16.578)
Mm-hmm.

Bishop DeDe (17:20.878)
Mm-hmm.

Bishop DeDe (17:28.152)
That's right.

Bishop DeDe (17:37.496)
Mm-hmm.

Adam Eichelberger (17:39.793)
those steps for Al-Anon was, that was one of the hardest things to relinquish control and put the control of these things, put the responsibility of these things I can or cannot control in the hands of God as I come to understand God. And I think that that is, I don't know if you feel this way, Bishop, I feel like that's essential for us right now is it feels like we're running from things, but also we gotta unload this burden and put it on the one who can handle that burden.

Bishop DeDe (17:53.709)
Mm-hmm.

Adam Eichelberger (18:09.2)
Because we're not God

Bishop DeDe (18:12.0)
No, and you know what we do not to cut in too much here, but we also take on too much. want to be responsible for everything. And in the given day, I do believe we're only there's only one or two things we're actually called to do that day because God knows that we're not really up to, you know, lifting that main that much weight. And so to create space in our lives for something new and speaking of humility, a great thing to do when you think about whimsy is to do something you're not that you're

that you don't really have a skill for that's out of your wheelhouse. That's not one of your strengths. I full confession every day, every day I work on learning Spanish. Now for those listeners who may not know this about me, I'm really rubbish at learning languages. I just want a full confession. I'm not good at it. I was thrilled. I think I said this on this podcast. I was thrilled because I actually understood one sentence out of the Super Bowl halftime in Spanish.

It took 25 years for that moment for me to be able to hear, know, believe in yourself. I mean, it was the little things, you know, I'm not good at this, but I have to say being in the space of learning something where it's not a skill, but I'm kind of doing it. It helps me be connected to that part of me that's still learning and growing. That's still a kid trying to grow up in this world. We all have that part of us.

Adam Eichelberger (19:14.386)
It's the little victories, Bishop. It's the little victories.

Bishop DeDe (19:36.202)
And so if we insulate ourselves too much in the process of learning and becoming, we can kind of start thinking that we're responsible for everything and we can kind of start thinking that we know everything. And then that fear of loss of control becomes overwhelming. But when we allow ourselves little spaces in our lives where it's not about perfection, it's not about mastery, it's about the journey, it's about the learning, it's about what I'm going to learn along the way.

And so maybe we take up a hobby or maybe we spend time doing something where it's just not in our wheelhouse, but we're there with humility to allow ourselves to grow as a human. It really is great ballast in a world that is so certain that it knows everything. It's a really good idea. But go ahead, you were gonna say something else.

Adam Eichelberger (20:26.428)
I 100 % agree. so my second question, and I want to make sure that we have time for a listener question that was submitted. So I wanted to ask you this, and then we'll get to our listeners question. You talked at the beginning about this different sense of grief. Like we've covered some other senses of grief. And I think the thing that's really striking to me in this moment is, regardless of where you fall,

ideologically, which I know is sometimes a dangerous word to throw out there. But regardless of where you fall, I feel like a lot of people are grieving this shift in our culture. I'm going to speak specifically for us here in the United States, this kind of shift in our culture to something that is a little different and a little difficult. And how do we

navigate the tension and this is going to be a good setup for our listener question I think. How do we navigate that tension because we're all grieving this stuff but it seems like we're grieving different experiences. How do we do that while also not siloing without like alienating other people without siloing? How do we do that in this moment?

Bishop DeDe (21:46.668)
Wow. And Lister, I'm opening it up to you because I think that is a really great question. You know, it's almost, the answer is almost it's impossible to do it. You know, it's in this moment, we get so caught up in things and to sort of create that distance and slow our roll. You know, I talk a lot about don't watch the news, read the news because the music and the tie-in and the lead in and voices and people arguing.

It's not that we can't learn something from that, but it overwhelms us. We kind of stop hearing in a certain way. I think it's really important in this time to create space for ourselves to be with things, to just be present to the fact that this is not what we want the world to be like, to grieve that the world isn't more the way we had hoped it would be. And those of us of a certain age, it feels like we've worked a lot of our lives with this ideal or this ideology.

that we wanted to make the world a better place. And then we come face to face with war and division and hardheartedness and all of the things. It can feel like we failed and we didn't do what we said we were gonna do, which is another piece of grief. But life is really about being, not doing. And so when we're cut off from ourselves, can lose, we can destabilize, we can lose that connection with ourselves.

And so I think being gentle with ourselves the way we want to be gentle with other people, to have some whimsy, to step back from the edge of the cliff as it were with self-recrimination and being hard on ourselves, and then to do one good thing that moves us toward what we want the world to be, to pray, to listen, to learn, to move toward the grace of Jesus. But that's a very...

Each of us, think, we each have to answer that in our own soul. What today will help me to move toward Jesus? What today will help me be a better Christian person, whole person? And here we are in the season of Lent. It's a very Lenten question, to fast and pray and to change our mind. Maybe that thing that seems like such a good idea is what is actually keeping us from God.

Bishop DeDe (24:10.688)
Maybe that practice that seems such a good idea is restricting us from actually experiencing Jesus. Each of us, it's a discernment we each have to make, I think.

Adam Eichelberger (24:23.565)
I wholeheartedly agree with everything you just said. All right. So as we, as we kind of wrap up our time this episode, I wanted to ask a question for Sarah. Sarah is a listener from Oklahoma city, Oklahoma. And she has shared that they kind of have a difficult relationship with a family member who lives far away, but they have very differing opinions on things. And it kind of seems

Bishop DeDe (24:36.056)
Hey, Sarah.

Adam Eichelberger (24:50.567)
to come to a head on social media a lot. like Sarah will post things and this person in their life, in Sarah's life tends to like argue about it or whatever. And she even says like, she kind of jumps into the conversation about this, this loved one's things. So her question, we talked about a little bit on this podcast, but I think it's a good revisit, especially what we're talking about today. What do I do when I, when someone I love keeps posting things on social media that I really disagree with and how

Bishop DeDe (24:53.41)
Mmm.

Bishop DeDe (24:59.692)
Mm-hmm.

Adam Eichelberger (25:19.709)
Can I handle that without blowing up the relationship?

Bishop DeDe (25:25.314)
Well, Sarah, welcome to the club. So many of us have someone in our life. We all are thinking, like so and so we all have a person and that temptation to want to fix them is strong. Isn't it? We just want to change them. And years ago, I was sharing this actually with the clergy last week, I was in a parish where they'd had been torn apart by an issue and I was listening to someone with whom I really strongly, mean, righteous indignation agreed, disagreed with them.

Adam Eichelberger (25:28.145)
Hahaha

Bishop DeDe (25:54.72)
I really felt like God should send lightning bolts at them. I really was listening to them thinking, my heavens, this is so not Jesus. And I had this thought came to my head, which I think was inspired, was what you want to say to them is what they're wanting to say to you. And so I listened to the person and I was conscious of thinking, what's wrong with them? Why do they think this? Don't they realize? Can't they understand?

And then I made myself think for a minute that what they were saying to me is, what's wrong with her? Why can't she understand? What does she, you know, doesn't get this? And then to listen with a different purpose, rather than refuting, you're not going to change each other's minds. Whatever the impasse is you have with this loved one, it's not like there's a great sentence that if you post it on social media, that person is suddenly going to go, you're right. I've changed my mind. You know, that's not how redemption happens, not how we.

We don't change your minds that way. But what does change us is love and mercy. And what does change us is discipline in the other person. When we have the discipline to say, I hear you saying this, I just want you to know I care about you. This makes my heart hurt, but maybe we can talk about something else. Social media is not the place to have a relationship. Social media is a platform that is just opposition, opposition, opposition.

And most of the time, people who are desk scrolling or doom scrolling through social media are doing so to find people who say what they wish they could say out loud. So that's not going to be a good relationship. But what is a good relationship is to find time to talk about things with who about things you can agree on and then to just say, look, you know, you and I, are never going to agree on this. So maybe we could just focus in on the fact that we love each other and that I really care about you.

and I want you to be happy in your life and I don't want you to be harmed. So maybe we can talk about things that we can have conversation about. I know a mother daughter, they talk about gardening because they can talk about gardening together and that's a good safe topic. So I think one, recognizing what social media is and is not. Two, to use it wisely. think really social media is.

Bishop DeDe (28:18.208)
If it makes you feel better to put things out there, it's great, but be mindful of tokenism, be mindful of virtue signaling, be mindful of living out our anxiety and our emotions by wanting other people to validate what we think to be true. And if they don't validate it, we feel like they've harmed us in some way. So to kind of slow down, to offer what it is you're wanting. So if you're wanting acceptance, to offer acceptance, not that you're going to change your mind.

Not that you're going to approve of the message, not that you're going to say, I accept that this is your racism is good. No, we never accept that. That is not true. But we accept that this is the person's best right now. And right now, this is where they are. And so we're going to just not fight about that anymore and accept what is and find a way to communicate the love that we have for the person.

And I think when we do that, it's not going to fix the impasse. We're not going to, you know, go singing off into the sunset, but it will help us not do more damage because every time we fight fire with fire, create a bigger fire. Every time we are hard hearted against hard heartedness, we become harder. And the solution is not to become what we're trying to fight. So if we want inclusivity to be inclusive and inclusive.

means accepting other people as they are and that they're doing their best and there's something that may be scaring them. And we can have compassion about that because there's things that scare us, know, people who say those things. but having that compassion for other people will help us be compassionate with ourselves and will foster a different narrative. So I think that's how we do it. Hard work.

It's hard work to be a bridge builder. And there are times with toxic people when we have to say, know, someone can talk to you. I cannot, because this doesn't feel like I can do it right now. And so Sarah in your own heart, you're going to, you know, that's a journey for you to sort of pray about and talk with someone, find someone with whom you can talk and share that. Well, friends, it's been great to have this podcast to talk about our faith, talk a bit about grief.

Bishop DeDe (30:35.714)
to talk about destabilization and the grief we may have about how life is, to talk about the temptation to dehumanize and what it is to listen to someone with whom we disagree and try to find that mutuality of at least recognizing humanity in one another. So in this time, when there's so much going on, I pray that you will know that you are loved, that you will be blessed and be a blessing, and we'll speak about faith again soon. Take good care.